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	<title>Comments on: Bigger than Madoff: Entitlement Programs</title>
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	<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/</link>
	<description>Business and Personal Finance for Millennials</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 22 Aug 2010 18:50:26 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: nick</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-10233</link>
		<dc:creator>nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Apr 2010 06:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-10233</guid>
		<description>And if nothing was done?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And if nothing was done?</p>
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		<title>By: Howard</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-9580</link>
		<dc:creator>Howard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 06:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-9580</guid>
		<description>Iam all for tweaking our health care system, but not a complete overhaul thatBarak Obama (BO) is forcing on us. The people have spoken, and the majority do not want the change he proposing. It amounts to yet another entitlement program that we can not afford. In his response to being asked if the U.S. Post Office would survive if it was part of the private sector,Michael Moore said to Hannity a few months ago on his tv show that &quot;who says they have to show a profit&quot;.Hannity did not have an answer,well I do. If they don&#039;t need to show a profit, then why do they charge us for their services. Stamps should be free! Heck, by paying for the stamps, the Post Office is actually double charging us aren&#039;t they. I mean its our tax money that runs the post office in the first place!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Iam all for tweaking our health care system, but not a complete overhaul thatBarak Obama (BO) is forcing on us. The people have spoken, and the majority do not want the change he proposing. It amounts to yet another entitlement program that we can not afford. In his response to being asked if the U.S. Post Office would survive if it was part of the private sector,Michael Moore said to Hannity a few months ago on his tv show that &#8220;who says they have to show a profit&#8221;.Hannity did not have an answer,well I do. If they don&#8217;t need to show a profit, then why do they charge us for their services. Stamps should be free! Heck, by paying for the stamps, the Post Office is actually double charging us aren&#8217;t they. I mean its our tax money that runs the post office in the first place!</p>
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		<title>By: nick</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-6877</link>
		<dc:creator>nick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 18:22:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-6877</guid>
		<description>Daniel, those other countries have higher life expectancies and spend less of their GDP on healthcare. Your argument about socialized medicine and lower-quality care just isn&#039;t true.

As far as Canadians and Europeans going elsewhere for care, those are just anecdotes. If arguing about the merits of healthcare systems involves trading anecdotes, do you really want to be on the side of defending the US system?

While I understand your desire to get your own financial house in order and make your own arrangements, the healthcare system in the United States going bankrupt will affect more than just boomers using Medicare and the Gen X and Gen Yers who pay into it. Healthcare costs have been rising faster than incomes and GDP for over a decade. No one is immune from that, not even younger people, especially if they buy insurance on their own in the individual market. What about health savings accounts and other similar arrangements? 

Forget about it. A stay in a hospital ICU can cost several thousand PER DAY. No matter how frugal and prudent you are with your finances, costs like that will wipe anyone out in less than a month.

No serious change to the United States&#039; healthcare system will hurt boomers in 5-6 years (Medicare&#039;s trust fund will go bankrupt by 2015 or 2016) but they won&#039;t live as long to see the consequences as Gen Y will. Not in the short term, but in the medium-long term.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daniel, those other countries have higher life expectancies and spend less of their GDP on healthcare. Your argument about socialized medicine and lower-quality care just isn&#8217;t true.</p>
<p>As far as Canadians and Europeans going elsewhere for care, those are just anecdotes. If arguing about the merits of healthcare systems involves trading anecdotes, do you really want to be on the side of defending the US system?</p>
<p>While I understand your desire to get your own financial house in order and make your own arrangements, the healthcare system in the United States going bankrupt will affect more than just boomers using Medicare and the Gen X and Gen Yers who pay into it. Healthcare costs have been rising faster than incomes and GDP for over a decade. No one is immune from that, not even younger people, especially if they buy insurance on their own in the individual market. What about health savings accounts and other similar arrangements? </p>
<p>Forget about it. A stay in a hospital ICU can cost several thousand PER DAY. No matter how frugal and prudent you are with your finances, costs like that will wipe anyone out in less than a month.</p>
<p>No serious change to the United States&#8217; healthcare system will hurt boomers in 5-6 years (Medicare&#8217;s trust fund will go bankrupt by 2015 or 2016) but they won&#8217;t live as long to see the consequences as Gen Y will. Not in the short term, but in the medium-long term.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-6576</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Sep 2009 17:21:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-6576</guid>
		<description>With regard to Social Security, when I taught at a community college years ago, I paid into a Public Employee&#039;s Retirement Fund not SS.  The same is true of all Federal, state and county workers including our lawmakers.  If we could force them all to join SS, it would probably be the most robustly funded entitlement of the bunch.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With regard to Social Security, when I taught at a community college years ago, I paid into a Public Employee&#8217;s Retirement Fund not SS.  The same is true of all Federal, state and county workers including our lawmakers.  If we could force them all to join SS, it would probably be the most robustly funded entitlement of the bunch.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1645</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:04:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1645</guid>
		<description>Kathy,

Thank you for your response, and you are definitely entitled to your opinion, however I disagree with you on a fundamental level.  I do not believe that National Health Insurance/Coverage is a right, and in no way do I think it&#039;s criminal to not have it.  In fact I believe it&#039;s why we have the best standard of care in the world.  Look at Canada and Europe, with their socialized medicine they have to wait in line for months in order to see a Doctor (who has no motivation to be the best, because they limit his pay), and when something bad happens (like cancer), they still have to wait for months to get treatments.  The Europeans go to India and pay cash to get better treatment, and the Canadians come to the US to pay cash for better treatment.  Most members of these &quot;major Western industrialized&quot; nations do not go to the Doctor for regular checkups because they can&#039;t get in to see one, which means preventative medicine is not happening, yielding higher treatment costs for issues that could have been prevented in the first place.

Then, on top of that, why should I have to pay extra in taxes for someone who doesn&#039;t take care of their body?  Adult onset (type II) diabetes is running rampant through our country, and THIS is criminal because it&#039;s completely preventable with education.  Obesity is running rampant through our country, and it is preventable with education.

Like I said in the post, I&#039;m fine with paying into it until I retire, but I don&#039;t want any of it.  I&#039;m planning my finances so that I won&#039;t need the government to support me, I don&#039;t want to be a burden to other people, and I don&#039;t want my generation to be a burden to other generations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kathy,</p>
<p>Thank you for your response, and you are definitely entitled to your opinion, however I disagree with you on a fundamental level.  I do not believe that National Health Insurance/Coverage is a right, and in no way do I think it&#8217;s criminal to not have it.  In fact I believe it&#8217;s why we have the best standard of care in the world.  Look at Canada and Europe, with their socialized medicine they have to wait in line for months in order to see a Doctor (who has no motivation to be the best, because they limit his pay), and when something bad happens (like cancer), they still have to wait for months to get treatments.  The Europeans go to India and pay cash to get better treatment, and the Canadians come to the US to pay cash for better treatment.  Most members of these &#8220;major Western industrialized&#8221; nations do not go to the Doctor for regular checkups because they can&#8217;t get in to see one, which means preventative medicine is not happening, yielding higher treatment costs for issues that could have been prevented in the first place.</p>
<p>Then, on top of that, why should I have to pay extra in taxes for someone who doesn&#8217;t take care of their body?  Adult onset (type II) diabetes is running rampant through our country, and THIS is criminal because it&#8217;s completely preventable with education.  Obesity is running rampant through our country, and it is preventable with education.</p>
<p>Like I said in the post, I&#8217;m fine with paying into it until I retire, but I don&#8217;t want any of it.  I&#8217;m planning my finances so that I won&#8217;t need the government to support me, I don&#8217;t want to be a burden to other people, and I don&#8217;t want my generation to be a burden to other generations.</p>
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		<title>By: KATHY ROBERSON</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1644</link>
		<dc:creator>KATHY ROBERSON</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Feb 2009 17:39:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1644</guid>
		<description>Social security will always be there for every generation. Medicare and Maid have to be looked at separately.
 Point one: my generation, boomers, will not retire at the the rate they expect but, as myself and my friends, will continue to contribue to social security until our mid-70&#039;s.Therefore the projections will be proved to be wrong. 
 Point two:  a raise in the payroll tax for soc security will solve 80 % of the problem for us and succeeding generations.  When you poll Americans this is the preferred solution.
POINT three:  most Americans over 65 have only that check to survive on

Point four: we will all die and the system can be readjusted at that time, possibly means tested with a much better 401k supplement.  

The situation is very political and can not be touched bec when you poll Americans of ALL AGES they do not want to work forever and the polling is highly in favor of soc sec.

The cost of Health care is another isssue that can only be solved, long term, by all of us being in the pot and contributing.  This is not favorable to me bec i am covered, however, it is criminal that our country is the only major Western industrialized nation that does not have national health insurance.

Social security will defininitely be there for generation X and Y and claims to the ocntrary do not take into account the solutions (see AARP).  Most 
Americans are not rich.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Social security will always be there for every generation. Medicare and Maid have to be looked at separately.<br />
 Point one: my generation, boomers, will not retire at the the rate they expect but, as myself and my friends, will continue to contribue to social security until our mid-70&#8242;s.Therefore the projections will be proved to be wrong.<br />
 Point two:  a raise in the payroll tax for soc security will solve 80 % of the problem for us and succeeding generations.  When you poll Americans this is the preferred solution.<br />
POINT three:  most Americans over 65 have only that check to survive on</p>
<p>Point four: we will all die and the system can be readjusted at that time, possibly means tested with a much better 401k supplement.  </p>
<p>The situation is very political and can not be touched bec when you poll Americans of ALL AGES they do not want to work forever and the polling is highly in favor of soc sec.</p>
<p>The cost of Health care is another isssue that can only be solved, long term, by all of us being in the pot and contributing.  This is not favorable to me bec i am covered, however, it is criminal that our country is the only major Western industrialized nation that does not have national health insurance.</p>
<p>Social security will defininitely be there for generation X and Y and claims to the ocntrary do not take into account the solutions (see AARP).  Most<br />
Americans are not rich.</p>
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		<title>By: ontrider</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1465</link>
		<dc:creator>ontrider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:11:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1465</guid>
		<description>yes... but I&#039;m well aware of the flaws with a lot of your social programs and how politicians like to ignore them, haha.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yes&#8230; but I&#8217;m well aware of the flaws with a lot of your social programs and how politicians like to ignore them, haha.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1458</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jan 2009 13:36:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1458</guid>
		<description>@ Corey, yeah, 50% of the federal budget is scary, and it&#039;s going to be growing as a percentage into the foreseeable future!

@Ontrider... Thanks!  (Aren&#039;t you Canadian?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Corey, yeah, 50% of the federal budget is scary, and it&#8217;s going to be growing as a percentage into the foreseeable future!</p>
<p>@Ontrider&#8230; Thanks!  (Aren&#8217;t you Canadian?)</p>
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		<title>By: ontrider</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1457</link>
		<dc:creator>ontrider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jan 2009 04:46:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1457</guid>
		<description>You are right on the mark.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are right on the mark.</p>
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		<title>By: Corey</title>
		<link>http://www.youngandfrugal.com/2009/01/26/bigger-than-madoff-entitlement-programs/comment-page-1/#comment-1456</link>
		<dc:creator>Corey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jan 2009 01:29:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.youngandfrugal.com/?p=205#comment-1456</guid>
		<description>I have been talking about this for months, and even today my co-workers and I were actually discussing how there should be a way for the wealthy to elect not to take SS. 

I also agree that there needs to be a cut-off date based on age. I want the federal gov&#039;t to tell me NOW that I won&#039;t recieve SS or medicare so our generation can have the time to plan for it. 

Those three social programs are over 50% of the federal budget every year! It&#039;s ridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been talking about this for months, and even today my co-workers and I were actually discussing how there should be a way for the wealthy to elect not to take SS. </p>
<p>I also agree that there needs to be a cut-off date based on age. I want the federal gov&#8217;t to tell me NOW that I won&#8217;t recieve SS or medicare so our generation can have the time to plan for it. </p>
<p>Those three social programs are over 50% of the federal budget every year! It&#8217;s ridiculous.</p>
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